Toolbar lets TNT know whenever you are on the internet

[brainyiscool]

To preface this, This is not a spew random crap and scare everyone thread. I am a fan of the Neopets toolbar but wanted people to know what it does that TNT doesn't tell us about.

What it does
Every Minute whenever you are connected to the internet the Neopets Toolbar sends a message to the Neopets Server, EVEN WHEN IT IS NOT VISIBLE!

This message includes:

• What browser you are using
• What account you are logged into/have logged into
• The session data TNT uses to keep people logged in
• A unique ID for your toolbar
• Version of your toolbar

Why should I care?
Most of that stuff seems to be OK, but why does TNT need a lot of it? Does TNT need to be updated every minute as to what accounts you are logged into? Does TNT need to track your specific toolbar, so even if you clear cookies and get a new IP address they can track you? It seems some of the information that is sent seems to be for the sole purpose of tracking users.

Also, this constant check can be used to track when a person is online and for how long. Think about how scary that is! TNT can know how long you are online, how much of that is spent on Neopets, and should they alter their software a little, what web sites you go to. What if in the future you got better Random events just based on which sponsors sites you went to! Pretty scary!

If you would like to see this check, download the firefox TamperDate extension and then let your computer sit and watch the logs it creates. At least every minute it contacts the Neopets Server

[Siniri]

I'm not really too surprised. I assume that any free toolbar has some sort of spyware attached to it. That's why I haven't gotten the neopets one, despite Tarla's giveaways. Think about it -- why would they be encouraging people to get it unless they got something out of it (data about users, etc.)?

[Kess]

Honestly, giving away rare neopets items at random times is a brilliant way to get people to download and use it. The only way they could make it more universally used would be to have an avatar based on whether or not you had the toolbar up.

So of course, I expect to see that, soon.

This is probably one of viacom's ways of taking stock of their newly acquired property, in order to plan for future developments.

[Moonlight Flower]

I feel bad for anyone who would want to track what sites I go to. ^_-

I'm honestly not too surprised, either. None of the information they're getting, I really care about them having. So long as it doesn't cause my computer any real problems, I don't care. But it IS good to know.

[ggagahc]

That's actually pretty darned scary...TNT seems to be getting REALLY paranoid nowadays.

BTW, Moonlight Flower, is that the wolf from Okami? Because I SERIOUSLY want to play that game so badly!

[Officer 1BDI]

This is the sort of stuff I expected that kept me from downloading the thing in the first place. :\

My question is, does Neopets list/mention (however subtly) these aspects of the toolbar at all?

Last edited by Officer 1BDI on Sun Oct 01, 2006 4:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

[neobeth]

This is hardly surprising, most sites collect various information.

[stampsyne]

Q: If you have the toolbar on IE and then mostly use Firefox ... does the bar track both browsers?

I am just TOO curious sometimes

[mazil]

I don't find that surprising at all.. and not because I think that TNT is out to spy on us, but because surely those things provide the basic functionality of the toolbar?

Points #2 and #3 - the account and session data are ... well... a convenience, I imagine! (I guess there are links on the bar you can click on to go to Neopets pages, so it'd be nice to be kept logged in) I don't think it's particularly different to the cookies that are used every time you log into the website itself. The first point (the browser detection) is something that almost any interactive website needs to do at some point to provide javascript functionality.

I think the unique ID is probably the only really stalkerish thing... but I'm sure it could be argued for in terms of functionality too :-S

[PTP]

After reading this, I have since uninstalled my toolbar and deleted it off both browsers, deleted all my cookies and logged out of neo.

Had I known now what I knew when I d/l it, i wouldn't of d/l it in the first place.

[psyco_chick32]

*shrugs*
Meh. Some of that actually seems like it could be put to some use.
What browser I'm using? Excellent. Then Neopets might start making things for Opera users if more people are using Opera (same for FF, IE, etc.) And really... who cares? Oh noes, TNT knows I use FF! Gah!
What accounts I'm logged into... okay, well, I only log into two of my accounts regularly, anyway. And I'd appreciate the session data TNT uses to keep me logged in... it makes me feel better than I shouldn't fall for stupid log-in page scams, anyhow. And hey, maybe later it'll be used to track crackers who "magically" get your PW and log onto your account. Maybe somebody would see something weird with me being logged in here in Michigan... and then automagically over in CA or something.
Version of the toolbar... well, anybody with a toolbar wants to know what version you're using. It's a typing data thing. Your browser keeps track of what version you're using, too... in case that's a scary thing for anybody.
And what's so scary about a unique ID for my toolbar? I'm sure that's the number that they would attach all this... less-than-important information.

So TNT can see what sites I go to. Ohnoes? I highly doubt they'd give better random events ased on which sponsors sites you went to. HIGHLY doubt it.

If anything, this is a good thing. Perhaps TNT will use this knowledge for good, not evil, and start basing user wants on user preferences without us having to write in on a continuous basis...
*quickly goes to about 90 ninja sites*
There. maybe now TNT will see that I want a ninja pet.

(btw - not meant to be as sarcastically mean as it sounds... just my reaction)

[Moonlight Flower]

BTW, Moonlight Flower, is that the wolf from Okami? Because I SERIOUSLY want to play that game so badly!

Yes, it's Amaterasu. The game rocks. Got it the day it came out.

And yeah, I don't see how this is necesarrily a bad thing either... everyone who's freaking out is really quite paranoid - it's not like they're installing stuff that'll harm your computer, or trying to steal your identity.

Though I kinda figured something was up when the toolbar has to download it's buttons every time I start the browser. XD; In order to keep my neomail button and my Alert button flashing, it would have to constantly be contacting the neopets server.

[matchbow]

There is no reason why this should be surprising or alarming in any way. in fact, some of it has reasonable applications.

it sends a message to TNT servers every minute to check for Tarla's warehouse giveaways. they need your session data and user data to give you your prize. the unique toolbar ID is something that everything has in one form or another. if you're freaked out by this, then just stop using the internet. your browser has a unique ID as well, and sends messages to your IP server with similar data.

i find nothing scary or alarming about anything in this. though you stated that you're telling us what TNT isn't, the bulk of your information is speculation. there is no reason to believe that TNT keeps this data or uses it in any way other than for Tarla.

[brainyiscool]

This is the sort of stuff I expected that kept me from downloading the thing in the first place. :\

My question is, does Neopets list/mention (however subtly) these aspects of the toolbar at all?

Nope. And there are no options to change it so it doesn't contact Neo as much/at all.

Q: If you have the toolbar on IE and then mostly use Firefox ... does the bar track both browsers?

I am just TOO curious sometimes

No, Only the browser it is installed on.

There is no reason why this should be surprising or alarming in any way. in fact, some of it has reasonable applications.

it sends a message to TNT servers every minute to check for Tarla's warehouse giveaways. they need your session data and user data to give you your prize. the unique toolbar ID is something that everything has in one form or another. if you're freaked out by this, then just stop using the internet. your browser has a unique ID as well, and sends messages to your IP server with similar data.

I can understand it needs to check for give-aways, but does it need the session data for that? No. It could just check if there is a give-away happening at the moment and lead you there. When you click the link you could send your sennion information.

On another note, you are mistaken when you say "your browser has a unique ID as well, and sends messages to your IP server with similar data.". A browser has a useragent string which identifies itself but is the same for that browser and version (Unless specifically changed by the user)

i find nothing scary or alarming about anything in this. though you stated that you're telling us what TNT isn't, the bulk of your information is speculation. there is no reason to believe that TNT keeps this data or uses it in any way other than for Tarla.

Now I think that is a little Naive. While it is possible that they never store each check in a database (Which I'm sure they do but that's beside the point) each check is stored in an apache transfer log. With a simple log parsing program they can get all of this information.

[matchbow]

There is no reason why this should be surprising or alarming in any way. in fact, some of it has reasonable applications.

it sends a message to TNT servers every minute to check for Tarla's warehouse giveaways. they need your session data and user data to give you your prize. the unique toolbar ID is something that everything has in one form or another. if you're freaked out by this, then just stop using the internet. your browser has a unique ID as well, and sends messages to your IP server with similar data.

I can understand it needs to check for give-aways, but does it need the session data for that? No. It could just check if there is a give-away happening at the moment and lead you there. When you click the link you could send your sennion information.

On another note, you are mistaken when you say "your browser has a unique ID as well, and sends messages to your IP server with similar data.". A browser has a useragent string which identifies itself but is the same for that browser and version (Unless specifically changed by the user)
[/quote]
right, not your browser, my mistake. but you do have your specific IP address. and that is significantly more powerful than a neopets ID number and can be tracked easily. my point that the internet in general is harmful, and not just the neopets toolbar, still stands.

i find nothing scary or alarming about anything in this. though you stated that you're telling us what TNT isn't, the bulk of your information is speculation. there is no reason to believe that TNT keeps this data or uses it in any way other than for Tarla.

Now I think that is a little Naive. While it is possible that they never store each check in a database (Which I'm sure they do but that's beside the point) each check is stored in an apache transfer log. With a simple log parsing program they can get all of this information.

now isn't it you that's being naive? i believe, with no evidence, that neopets doesn't use, or possibly use, the info gathered by the toolbar for any harmful means. you too believe, with no evidence, that they do keep the evidence, and possibly that it is used for harmful means. let's just let our opinions stand until we see what TNT is really doing.