Editorial and Adblocking

[miz sparrow]

But perhaps, since blocking ads is allowed, it's only blocking images of things in shops that's disallowed, can we assume that turning off scripts to view user created pages to protect oneself from malicious scripts is okay, only using it to buy things from shops quicker is not?

I think the only way you could guarantee that you weren't getting the "unfair advantage of quicker buying" while protecting yourself would be to never buy anything. at all.

since that's pretty unlikely, if it was me, i'd stop scriptblocking for the time being, but email Neopets a comment/suggestion politely explaining why you wish that they would allow script blocking in order to allow you to both shop and protect yourself.

[anjuna]

Weren't they talking about having the page load before the ads now anyway? (I use premium so I haven't seen it in effect) So blocking ads wouldn't speed up the site and wouldn't be considered cheating.

TNT have said numerous times in the past that the deliberate blocking of "unprofitable" item images in shops is cheating, it effectively makes it easier for you to restock.

As far as "everyone having the capability" it's still cheating - after all everyone has the capability to download an AB program but we can't consider their usage "fair".

I believe Adam has already stated, [legally-speaking] TNT doesn't have a right to prevent anyone from blocking advertisements.

There are just far too many fine lines and grey areas here, in my opinion. Deliberately blocking "unprofitable item" images would likely be considered blatant "cheating" (even if the person were unaware this was somehow giving them an unfair advantage).

I happen to think there is no such thing as an auto-buyer "program" but something more along the lines of a very fast human with scripts disabled grabbing those precious Morphing Potions (for instance). I am not a coder, hacker, or cheater, but I can't even think of any way to get around the "you have to click on the Neopet in the picture to continue" part of purchasing from Neopian Shops. It is there for just that reason. If there is a program that can do that, I would be very very very surprised.

On a similar note, I believe that just because a user has scripts off (or Greasemonkey on, for instance) they are not necessarily scammers or cheaters. In fact most users might not realize this as "wrong" within their conscience. There is a grand difference between someone simply trying to speed up their page loading because they are on 'slow DSL' (as someone pointed out, dial-up users probably have a slim chance of restocking "unbuyables" or even items worth 5K or more whereas TNT wouldn't dream of freezing anyone with a T3 just because they can load a page in a heartbeat with or without scripts) and someone deliberately trying to scam another or exploit something about the site in general.

Duped items would fall into such category, as well as cookie grabbers; but I think it is almost shameful that TNT should go on a freezing rampage just to set an example in some sort of way, as a deterrent. It would be far better if they simply implemented something like, say instead of javascript at all, simply use HTML to redirect to a link. Most browsers can be configured to open any new link in a new window or tab. JavaScript is not even really needed! They could fire all their js programmers and re-hire them to re-code the site in a simpler HTML, less exploitable (especially if they disallow similar 'fancy' code on user/petpage lookups).

Sorry this rant is so long, but I just thought of another point. Quickstock, I always assumed, was supposed to give an advantage to players basically. I originally assumed it was a stock without JavaScript for that reason. I was wrong, beceause I know that in QS you will be 'notified' with a pop-up upon Donating OR Discarding items. Well, I personally wonder why in my Items page proper the same doesn't apply? I am only notified upon Discard, not Donate, and I know plenty of users that 'accidentally' Donated a valuable Item because of this. Talk about unfair advantage. Or poor coding. Like I said, TNT should use their energy to improve the site, and not go around willy nilly freezing users just to set an example to deter True Scammers. People that want to screw others over will always find a way. This is not the best way to 'weed them out' so to speak.

Especially 'checking a computer' for a plug-in is an invasion of privacy. Their ToC has not been updated for almost a year. They should consult with Lawyerbot regarding legal issues before implementing "rules" (imo).

The fact is, probably about 99.87% are not True Scammers, but happen to "tweak" our browsing interface so that we may enjoy a gaming site we love even more. That is nothing unusual and not inherently wrong.

If I have my mouse set to "jump" to the dialog box (where one would click OK or Cancel), since that is a 3rd party program, is THAT considered 'cheating' because it is an 'unfair advantage' over others that either don't have/know about or don't choose to use that mouse setting?

I hate to relate this to TNT's overall business model, but I can't help it. How much have blocked ads (despite the overwhelming number of users) hurt their profit? What were the demographic criteria that they based their Premium (ad-free) prices on? I believe that if you want to "bombard" your site with ads, but know you are popular and know that would hurt your user base, you would implement an alternative change. Take donations. Change to a payed site (no choice) and offer it at a price even a kid could afford with his/her weekly allowance. Who can afford $2 a month; raise your hand? I am on social assistance and can't even afford long distance, but Neopets can earn my respect. Anything but what this has become.

TNT appears to me a group of people looking for guidance. For someone to make decisions that they haven't a clue about. Would users rather pay for a game they can play offline? Or one they can take about, similar to a portable Playstation game, to use while riding the bus instead of a Walkman or iPod (okay, I am kinda old lol). The choice is almost obvious to me. If you are at your computer and play games for an hour or more at a time, most people have high-speed Internet so can play online (and will, for free). Most Neopets users actually 'crave' a favorite game of theirs they can take with them to play while waiting for an appointment, and if you charged $20 for a portable game device (that say, had the 'advantage' of yielding rare item codes the more you played it, similar to but DIFFERENT than their past portable hand-held game devices, I bet they would sell more, take in more "donation" (tax-free also) than they would charging a "only the people willing to pay for Premium" subscription.

[/rantoftheyear]

Famous Last Words: "And I just might write a stern letter ... "

[Kenjiro]

Don't worry, adblocking is definitely not against the rules. The staff have said that. Its when you start using Adblock to block images of unprofitable items to restock etc that it becomes abuse

As anjuna said above, the problem is the thin line you're walking. I've heard about people being innocently frozen all the time, it could just as well happen in this situation. TNT isn't that well-known for their thorough investigation to see whether someone is actually innocent or not..

The ads don't bother me at all, and if there were any inappropriate ads, I'd just report them and not follow the link so I could potentially get a virus..

I guess it's not entirely against the ruless, but then again I'd rather not take the chance.

[Asparagus Queen]

There is a grand difference between someone simply trying to speed up their page loading because they are on 'slow DSL' (as someone pointed out, dial-up users probably have a slim chance of restocking "unbuyables" or even items worth 5K or more whereas TNT wouldn't dream of freezing anyone with a T3 just because they can load a page in a heartbeat with or without scripts) and someone deliberately trying to scam another or exploit something about the site in general.

Actually, I believe people have gotten frozen for having a fast computer. I think I remember reading about users here, on PPT, getting frozen for using a game cheat because their computer was so fast they did well on a game, or something to that affect.

[ericlaw02]

If I have my mouse set to "jump" to the dialog box (where one would click OK or Cancel), since that is a 3rd party program, is THAT considered 'cheating' because it is an 'unfair advantage' over others that either don't have/know about or don't choose to use that mouse setting?

Long post...my eyes...[/offtopic]

But in theory, having an short username should be counted as "unfair advantage" too, cause you can login quicker.
But the question is, is it really possible to check out which data that you've adblocked? (memory recalls that there was a bug that allows you to do that, but well, i have bad memory...)
EDIT: yes, there was one, "Bugzilla Bug 16027: Should prevent probing for Adblock's scripts/images", not sure specifics though. (should be fixed)

Oh well, should be time to downgrade back to a P4 1.4ghz and 56k connection. [/sarcasm]
Seriously, I don't get how "new equipment" can make you perform better, flash games aren't like FPS games that use physics engines and stuff which you need to mind about your ping, fps, ping, fps, ping and ping.

[Moonlight Flower]

I think people are just overreacting a bit, personally. YES, there is a thin line, but so long as you ONLY block the adds, you AREN'T going to cross it.

Don't worry so much about it. It's just a game, you shouldn't have to fret so much over something you're supposed to have FUN playing.

Honestly, I love my account and stuff, but sadly, neo just isn't that much fun for me anymore unless there's a plot going on.. ^^";

[shapu]

Don't worry so much about it. It's just a game, you shouldn't have to fret so much over something you're supposed to have FUN playing.

Quit with the wisdom, we're griping here!

[Mongrel]

Quit with the wisdom, we're griping here!

You just summed up the point of about six active threads AND my boyfriend's roommate's philosophy on life.
In other words, I feel I must use an emoticon I don't think I've ever felt the need to use before:

[Meer]

Hey, we have to gripe. We have a reputation to live up to after all! (Pink Poogle Toy description)

[missnk]

Seriously, I don't get how "new equipment" can make you perform better, flash games aren't like FPS games that use physics engines and stuff which you need to mind about your ping, fps, ping, fps, ping and ping.

Actually, I sometimes play Neopets on my best friend's computer and a faster computer definitely makes a difference. It's seldom that I get a score lower than 202 on Usuki Frenzy when I play on my bff's computer because the Usul actually moves faster on her computer (no joke). On my computer, however, I usually average 195 on Usuki Frenzy and that's with me pounding away on the keyboard trying to get the Usul to move faster... It's funny because her computer is older than mine too....

[iceyi]

soon not paying for premium membership will be cheating... not clicking on ads will be cheating.. not buying advertized products will be cheating

[Morningstar]

soon not paying for premium membership will be cheating... not clicking on ads will be cheating.. not buying advertized products will be cheating

Excuse me, just where do you get that from? Adam told us several years ago that the site would always be free (and it is to non-paying members; premium is an optional feature) and that it was perfectly OK to hide ads. Please don't circulate rumors and cause mass hysteria unless you have some evidence to back this up.

Besides, it is their game. They make up the rules. If you want to play the game, you follow the rules. ALL of the rules. And if you don't want to or can't, you find another game to play.

[Kenjiro]

There's only a few posts to judge by, but methinks we have a troll on the forum? Either that or a very disgruntled and probably frozen user..

[fredajones]

Premium is as cheap as chips and I am astonished that people who spend lots of time and affort blocking ads do not just pay for it.

waits for I cannot afford it wails....

8 dollars a month, that's 2 dollars a week and just 29 cents a day. I'm in the UK so I am not quite sure what you can buy for 29 cents but it is the equivalent here of around 15p. A Mars bar or a can of Coke is around 35p or 40p.

If you buy the yearly subscription it brings the cost down to 19 cents a day - that's just 10p!

And at Christmas there was a huge offer, I think 20% off or similar? I renewed mine then and that brought the daily price down to the amount of money that you would not even bother to pick up in the street if you have to bend down.

It's a no brainer!

[Morningstar]

There's only a few posts to judge by, but methinks we have a troll on the forum? Either that or a very disgruntled and probably frozen user..

The same thought crossed my mind, Kenjiro. Especially since this and a few other threads were dredged up out of the dead files.

Premium is as cheap as chips and I am astonished that people who spend lots of time and affort blocking ads do not just pay for it.

waits for I cannot afford it wails....

Freda, you must be very lucky in that you don't have to worry about money. I am also fortunate in that respect. And I have premium. However, I have friends, adult friends, who barely make enough money to get by. Some of them are disabled, some of them are on pension, some of them are single moms and dads. And some have to choose between eating and paying for their meds. Or eating and fixing their car. I have friends in my guild who are in college and are so broke that they are practically living on air. So, that $8 a month means a lot to these people. What might seem so little to you and to me can be a very big deal to another person. And you ought to respect that person's feelings when they say that they can't afford premium. Instead of waiting for their "wails."