Journey to the Lost Isle Discussion [split 6]

[Meer]

I'm not sure if the p3 resemblance is intentional. Any well known bug has a high chance of resembling one of the petpetpets.

Well the friendly one is quite obviously a mootix, there's no doubt about it. But the one we fought doesn't look like any p3 to me, unless I'm forgetting one.

[nekonya]

Those antennas... Reminds me of a Grundo's...

*shrugs* Or maybe it's just me~ I really hope that something would happen soon. The suspense is totally killing meh! Guess I should go and train my pets now if there's gonna be a battle in the future.

[littleboy6326]

I can't view the comics on my work computer, but from memory, isn't the plant-munching bug basically a giant fat caterpillar? The Mootix has the same segmented stripes, but it also has little paddy feet and reminds me more of a flea.

Imagine a giant Blechy. That'd be scary.

I *do* think we should stop solving people's puzzles for them, otherwise they'll get prizes too, as well as the people who honestly worked hard for them.

It's like logging into the battledome, and fighting their fights for them!

I don't think there's anything wrong with helping people who are really stuck. After all, these plots are MEANT to be solved in teams. Especially like this, where some people's puzzles are tougher than others - what if two people have spent the same amount of time working on their puzzle, and one has got lucky and the other hasn't? Can you really say that the second person hasn't worked as hard as the first person? You may regret telling others to do it themselves if you end up well and truly stuck yourself when the puzzles start getting hard.

For the last several plots, the only way to get the best trophies has been putting in a whole lot of hard work - not just doing the basic steps required to reach the end of the plot. Those who really work on the plot (like by doing loads of battling) will be rewarded when it comes to prize time.

But how do we know whether someone has actually tried to do their puzzle or whether they just want us to do it for them?

I'm quite suprised it's not against the rules-- especially things like the Constellation finder.

[eilu]

... But the one we fought doesn't look like any p3 to me, unless I'm forgetting one.

How about a moach? A really ugly, giant-ified moach. Well, that's a bit of a stretch, but it did resemble a mantid.

[Siniri]

I *do* think we should stop solving people's puzzles for them, otherwise they'll get prizes too, as well as the people who honestly worked hard for them.

It's like logging into the battledome, and fighting their fights for them!

I don't think there's anything wrong with helping people who are really stuck. After all, these plots are MEANT to be solved in teams. Especially like this, where some people's puzzles are tougher than others - what if two people have spent the same amount of time working on their puzzle, and one has got lucky and the other hasn't? Can you really say that the second person hasn't worked as hard as the first person? You may regret telling others to do it themselves if you end up well and truly stuck yourself when the puzzles start getting hard.

For the last several plots, the only way to get the best trophies has been putting in a whole lot of hard work - not just doing the basic steps required to reach the end of the plot. Those who really work on the plot (like by doing loads of battling) will be rewarded when it comes to prize time.

Some of the people who've posted here have posted their next puzzle 5 minutes after someone solved the last one for them. And people still gave them the answer. I've helped three people with theirs -- the first had a ridiculously easy puzzle (and didn't thank me for my hints). She did whine about no one helping her before I posted the hints, though. The second and third puzzles were harder (especially the third -- I had to print and cut it out to solve it). Both those users thanked me for the hints (not the solutions).

I've never had someone give me the answer to a puzzle on Neopets; nor would I want to. I think hints are fine, but we have every right to complain about moochers who don't want to do the work for themselves. And no, I don't think solving the puzzles is about "luck" -- it's about using your brain. You can systematically try each piece in one of the corners, with each other piece fitting next to its one side, etc. and use process of elimination. You're guaranteed to solve it (assuming it's solveable). I don't mind people asking for hints, but demanding solutions, in my opinion, is lazy and wrong. So I won't be a part of that. If you want to, feel free. We have the right to disagree.

Re: constellation finder and plot walk-throughs -- I view those as hints rather than solutions. For the constellation finder, you still had to solve the puzzles to get to the constellation-finding part. And finding the stars wasn't really a puzzle. So the constellation finder was a time-saver rather than giving the answer away.

[eastdeltac]

I need a little help. I don't like asking for it, but at the same time, if I need it I'll ask for it.

Here is the link to my third puzzle I just can't solve it, no matter how I place the pieces. Of course some one else will probably be able to do it in about 30 seconds.

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y159/e ... zle312.jpg

[Daze]

... But the one we fought doesn't look like any p3 to me, unless I'm forgetting one.

How about a moach? A really ugly, giant-ified moach. Well, that's a bit of a stretch, but it did resemble a mantid.

I think it was a skritch

[Jerch]

I *do* think we should stop solving people's puzzles for them, otherwise they'll get prizes too, as well as the people who honestly worked hard for them.

It's like logging into the battledome, and fighting their fights for them!

I don't think there's anything wrong with helping people who are really stuck. After all, these plots are MEANT to be solved in teams. ....

I'd say that parts of these plots are meant to be solved in teams, like the grave-digging and potions mixing from the last plot. To a certain extent, even walkthroughs for plots are expected by TNT, otherwise, we would not have a plot board in the main site.

However, there are parts that TNT had specifically coded them to be different for everyone - the layout of the temple of a 1000 tombs, the string-climbing in the last plot, and this plot's puzzle - I would gather that they have done this for a reason. And what reason is there, but for us to work on it by ourselves, and not simply following others' instructions?

Just think of it this way, why didn't TNT include a nifty option that can allow me to 'send my puzzle' to other users, so that they can solve it for me? Or somehow change the puzzle into a format that can be shared on the neopet's plot board? What it comes down to is, that by pressing Print Screen with the intention of asking for help, we already are circumventing the unspoken rules laid down by TNT.

Nevertheless, it is not entirely unreasonable to ask for help with a particularly hard puzzle...After all, the world isn't painted in black and white, and it is ultimately the user's own decision.

Last edited by Jerch on Tue May 08, 2007 1:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[Morningstar]

I *do* think we should stop solving people's puzzles for them, otherwise they'll get prizes too, as well as the people who honestly worked hard for them.

It's like logging into the battledome, and fighting their fights for them!

The members of PPT have always helped each other out. Always. That's why this is referred to as a help site. And in the last two plots, many of us wouldn't have been able to get through some of the steps without the help of others. Not only from PPTers, but Neopets members who worked long and hard on creating petpages with outlined steps. If everyone kept all of the answers to themselves, no one would get anywhere in any of the plots. I see nothing wrong with people asking for help with their puzzles. However, I do like the idea of giving placement of only 3 pieces and letting a person figure out that rest on their own.

[eastdeltac]

I don't think there's anything wrong with helping people who are really stuck. After all, these plots are MEANT to be solved in teams. ....

[/quote]

I'd say that parts of these plots are meant to be solved in teams, like the grave-digging and potions mixing from the last plot. To a certain extent, even walkthroughs for plots are expected by TNT, otherwise, we would not have a plot board in the main site.

However, there are parts that TNT had specifically coded them to be different for everyone - the layout of the temple of a 1000 tombs, the string-climbing in the last plot, and this plot's puzzle - I would gather that they have done this for a reason. And what reason is there, but for us to work on it by ourselves, and not simply following others' instructions?

Just think of it this way, why didn't TNT include a nifty option that can allow me to 'send my puzzle' to other users, so that they can solve it for me? Or somehow change the puzzle into a format that we can be shared on the neopet's plot board? What it comes down to is, that by pressing Print Screen with the intention of asking for help, we already are circumventing the unspoken rules laid down by TNT.

Nevertheless, it is not entirely unreasonable to ask for help with a particularly hard puzzle...After all, the world isn't painted in black and white, and it is ultimately the user's own decision.[/quote]


I have to agree. I don't like everyone asking for help with every tiny little bit of a plot, but I have no problems with people asking for help when they are really stuck and have been trying for a long time.

[twinklyspangle]

I *do* think we should stop solving people's puzzles for them, otherwise they'll get prizes too, as well as the people who honestly worked hard for them.

It's like logging into the battledome, and fighting their fights for them!

I don't think there's anything wrong with helping people who are really stuck. After all, these plots are MEANT to be solved in teams. Especially like this, where some people's puzzles are tougher than others - what if two people have spent the same amount of time working on their puzzle, and one has got lucky and the other hasn't? Can you really say that the second person hasn't worked as hard as the first person? You may regret telling others to do it themselves if you end up well and truly stuck yourself when the puzzles start getting hard.

For the last several plots, the only way to get the best trophies has been putting in a whole lot of hard work - not just doing the basic steps required to reach the end of the plot. Those who really work on the plot (like by doing loads of battling) will be rewarded when it comes to prize time.

Some of the people who've posted here have posted their next puzzle 5 minutes after someone solved the last one for them. And people still gave them the answer. I've helped three people with theirs -- the first had a ridiculously easy puzzle (and didn't thank me for my hints). She did whine about no one helping her before I posted the hints, though. The second and third puzzles were harder (especially the third -- I had to print and cut it out to solve it). Both those users thanked me for the hints (not the solutions).

I've never had someone give me the answer to a puzzle on Neopets; nor would I want to. I think hints are fine, but we have every right to complain about moochers who don't want to do the work for themselves. And no, I don't think solving the puzzles is about "luck" -- it's about using your brain. You can systematically try each piece in one of the corners, with each other piece fitting next to its one side, etc. and use process of elimination. You're guaranteed to solve it (assuming it's solveable). I don't mind people asking for hints, but demanding solutions, in my opinion, is lazy and wrong. So I won't be a part of that. If you want to, feel free. We have the right to disagree.

Re: constellation finder and plot walk-throughs -- I view those as hints rather than solutions. For the constellation finder, you still had to solve the puzzles to get to the constellation-finding part. And finding the stars wasn't really a puzzle. So the constellation finder was a time-saver rather than giving the answer away.

I agree totally. Some poeple on here are just signing up to PPT, getting their puzzles solved by someone else, and then leaving again. I know there are no RULES against it, but Matty came on and posted his own website, which I'm sure we are not allowed to do, and offered to solve everyones puzzles.

This plot is not MEANT to be done by large groups of people. It doesn;t say that anywhere, it's meant to be each person doing the work for themselves and getting rewarded for it. They wouldn't have bothered giving us all different puzzles otherwise would they?

I just think people should try a little harder.

EDIT

I am concerned that I have come across as a meanie here. I'm really not, I totally understand and appriciate all the help I have got from folks here over the years.

The problem is, and what I was trying to encourage people to do, that noone really seems to TRY theirs anymore. Since setting up my help guide (linked in siggy - free plug) I have recieved 54 neomails and about 50K in gifts from people who say that my tips have helped them solve their puzzles, and they were geniunlly happy that they had put the effort in themselves, and know when they get their rewrad, they will deserve it

[Wizziwig]

I think it might be worth setting rules that we only help when people take the time to set their puzzle into Tetris format (which shows they've at least put some effort in - people who are too lazy to solve it as oppose to generally stuck wont want to go this far) and that we only ever give the first three pieces, this way they still need to work the rest out for themselves, but at least have some idea of where to start. What do people think to this suggestion?

I also think it may be worth having a different post for puzzle number 1 as it is infuriating reading through the plot stage where it is now and it being interupted by people on puzzle one!

[Siniri]

I also didn't mean to imply that no one should ask for help. Of course we're all here to help and get help -- that's why PPT has this forum. But there's a difference between asking for help and asking for someone to do it for you. I'm sorry if anyone asking for help misunderstood. Of course you should ask for help. But I, for one, will only give you a hint in the right direction. And most people here seem to appreciate that. They do want to solve it for themselves. If I had asked for a hint and gotten a solution instead, I'd personally have been a bit disappointed that they made it too easy for me.

My comments were mostly in reference to the few people who seem to join PPT just to get answers, not to help others or get hints. I know that PPT's rules for things like the Lenny Conundrum are that you post hints but not solutions until after it's been judged. Shouldn't the same rule apply here?

Again, please do ask for help if you need it. I am offering assistance; I like these puzzles and have a lot of practice at them. And I don't think any less of you if you do need help -- I've needed it before for other plots (and I'm sure at some point in this one, I might need it again). Some puzzles are tougher than others, and different people are good at different kinds of puzzles. That's why we have this forum!

On a completely different topic, do you think this is a mini Altador-style plot or a "full" plot? It's hard to tell at this point. I'm hoping since there was battling that it's a full plot.

[cybertrini]

I also didn't mean to imply that no one should ask for help. Of course we're all here to help and get help -- that's why PPT has this forum. But there's a difference between asking for help and asking for someone to do it for you. I'm sorry if anyone asking for help misunderstood. Of course you should ask for help. But I, for one, will only give you a hint in the right direction. And most people here seem to appreciate that. They do want to solve it for themselves. If I had asked for a hint and gotten a solution instead, I'd personally have been a bit disappointed that they made it too easy for me.

My comments were mostly in reference to the few people who seem to join PPT just to get answers, not to help others or get hints. I know that PPT's rules for things like the Lenny Conundrum are that you post hints but not solutions until after it's been judged. Shouldn't the same rule apply here?

Again, please do ask for help if you need it. I am offering assistance; I like these puzzles and have a lot of practice at them. And I don't think any less of you if you do need help -- I've needed it before for other plots (and I'm sure at some point in this one, I might need it again). Some puzzles are tougher than others, and different people are good at different kinds of puzzles. That's why we have this forum!

On a completely different topic, do you think this is a mini Altador-style plot or a "full" plot? It's hard to tell at this point. I'm hoping since there was battling that it's a full plot.

I tend to agree. I needed help with my own 3rd puzzle, and I got it. Since then, I have tried to help others who have posted asking for help (though I haven't been faster than others who solved it and posted the solution/tip) and I was able to help some of my friends with their own.

Even though I was given the full solution, had I only been given the first 3 I think I would have been ok with that. I don't know I believe that those who need help with their first puzzle are really trying, since most ppl seem to get through their first 2 fairly quickly, judging by most of the posts I have seen. But if I can help, I will try to because I think that's a big part of fansites like this one.

As for whether this is a full plot or a half plot, I'm just hoping that this one has more puzzles than battles. I am not sure Raz can handle opponents that are too strong (he's a bit of a coward, lol...)

[Arka]

I didn't need help, but it was reassuring to me to feel that rather than being terribly frustrated that I could come here if I did need help. I don't mind helping people who have tried and are truly stuck. I have been doing it with paper and pencil, though. It didn't occur to me to print it out and do it. I wish we could just plug it (the puzzles we are helping with) in to the software like our own puzzles were, it was so easy to do it when the computer would place the pieces.