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 Post subject: Trading Pets? Legal or not?
PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 1:43 am 
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Say you have a krawk. You really want a Draik. Or say you have a faerie pet and you'd really like a rainbow pet. Well, is it legal to switch pets with your friend or troll the boards looking for someone to switch with?

The reason why I ask is that I see lots of boards these days, some saying it is legal and some saying it isn't.

Both people are pointing back to last weeks editorial, which is kind of confusing.

The people who say it isn't legal point back to the same editorial as the people why say it is legal.

The people who say it is legal are saying "But no neopoints, items, or valuables are being traded. The only thing being traded are the pets themselves. We aren't doing this for money or valuables. We are doing it for free because we want to switch pets with someone."

The people who are saying it isn't legal count the pets themselves as a valuable commodity.

The people who want to switch pets say "But this is what transferring is for!"

And the others are saying that transferring isn't intended to help people switch or trade pets with someone permanently. Yeah, maybe people can safely lend an avator pet now, but they should give it back.

Then transferring is also for maybe moving pets around on side accounts or giving away a lab pet if you run an adoption agency.

But they say that transferring isn't supposed to be used to swap pets with your friend.

So it is still kind of confusing and I wish the staff would say what was really legal and what they really intended it all for.


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 Post subject: Re: Trading Pets? Legal or not?
PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 2:26 am 
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I was just reading a board on this on the BD Chat :P Unfortunately, since there appears to be no clear answer, this will end up being debated as much as the -4^2 incident. I hope TNT addresses this issue in this week's Editorial


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 Post subject: Re: Trading Pets? Legal or not?
PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 2:45 am 
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I wish they'd answer it in the news as soon as possible because the many people who think this is legal may be surprised to find themselves frozen if it isn't legal. Well, I actually haven't heard of anyone getting frozen or warnings just yet and I have seen a lot of boards like "I have a cybunny I'd like to trade for a-" type boards. So I don't know, if people are getting frozen or warnings we should start to hear about it soon. I'll just have to keep a look out.

Personally, I would never switch my pets with anyone else's. I worked hard for mine and I like them too much. But I don't begrudge others the chance to do that if they want to.


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 Post subject: Re: Trading Pets? Legal or not?
PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 8:51 pm 
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I don't see why it wouldn't be legal. Fostering and adopting is legal, yes? Well, what's the difference between two people switching pets, and two people adopting out for each other? The way I see it, you are just trading equal things. If you trade items, that's ok. If you trade art, that's ok. They don't want you paying for your art, and they don't want you buying pets. Two people freely gifting each other pets shouldn't be a problem either.


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 Post subject: Re: Trading Pets? Legal or not?
PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 9:40 pm 
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The FAQ implies it can be permanant quite clearly.

Quote:
10. A friend and I traded pets but now I want my pet back but they won't trade back with me, what can I do?

Once you choose to let your pet go, even if it's to a friend, your pet will belong to them. So please be sure that letting your pet leave your account is what you want because this is solely your responsibility and choice.

Also, please remember when trading pets, accepting tips/payments of any kind will get both accounts frozen.


Seems pretty clear to me you can exchange Neopets "legally" without any problems.


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 Post subject: Re: Trading Pets? Legal or not?
PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 9:58 pm 
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Editorial answer for reference:
Quote:
To explain as simply as possible, the first thing someone should understand is that, once they choose to let their Neopet go (even if it's to a friend), the Neopet no longer belongs to them. Therefore, they need to be sure that letting their Neopet leave the account is what they want, because this is solely their responsibility and choice. Secondly, as of this writing, the selling of Neopets and trading of Neopets for items, Neopoints, etc. is also against the rules. Therefore, if you are caught doing it you could lose the Neopet and your account.


I think it's legal, or at least it should be. Saying it's illegal means if you give someone a pet, they absolutely cannot give you one. That would make what I did illegal: Sending one of my 4 pets to my side, and sending another pet from that side to my main (for an avatar).

I think the editorial was just saying "Yes you can, but beware. Once the pet is out of your account, it's not yours. Be sure you trust who you send it to." It used to be like that when people would send avatar items to each other, but recently they've said that if there was an agreement and someone walked off with the item is now considered scamming. It's a pretty gray area, but I don't think trading pets is illegal. I don't know why they shoved that PSA about items/neopoints into the answer, but that may be the part that is confusing everyone.

If you are trading pets, I'd get it in Neomail or on the boards, somewhere in writing so that you can prove there was a mutual agreement. That way you could maybe report them for scamming if they don't hold up their end of the deal.


And the FAQ in the post above mine just seals the deal to me. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Trading Pets? Legal or not?
PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2008 12:13 am 
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Everyone on the Help Chat thinks otherwise (not me included). Some have even taken it upon themselves to 'translate' the words of the Neopets staff.

What I don't understand is, why can't TNT skip the Editorial and just edit the FAQ. People clearly don't get it and need everything spelling out (me included) so why not cut to the chase and say a clear 'trading one pet for another pet is fine, so long as that is all that is being traded' along with all the spiel about how it's up to them if they want to trade back and so on. They probably should have added an actual 'trade' feature though. It would make av lending a lot easier since you'd get a pet for the other of equal value as collateral in the event of something weird happening. Like them getting frozen along with your pet.


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 Post subject: Re: Trading Pets? Legal or not?
PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2008 3:01 am 
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And this week's editorial addresses this even more clearly; it's legal.

Quote:
Okay, I understand that trading Neopets for items, NP, etc. is not okay. However, is trading a Neopet for another Neopet okay? I've seen a lot of people trying to trade Neopets and claiming it's okay, but you've never actually said that it's okay, have you? The thing they are showing as proof that it's okay is a question in the Pound FAQ that's about Neopet trading. ~888ninetales888
Yes, trading Neopets (even though we don't like the idea of players trading their Neopets) is tolerated, but only if it is a 1:1 swap. This means no "extras" sent before/during/after the swap that might include Neopoints, items, accounts, coding, art, or anything else that would be considered an illegal payment. If there is an agreement to trade Neopets and the process has already begun (one of the Neopets has already been sent) then the other person must fulfill their side of the bargain or return the Neopet. Running off with one after a trade has begun is considered scamming and will result in that player being frozen. It is unlikely you will get your Neopet back if this occurs, though, so use good judgment as to who you swap with!


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 Post subject: Re: Trading Pets? Legal or not?
PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2008 4:43 am 
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Ha! Is not not pretty much exactly what I said :P *gloats in her big fat ego all gloatily like* 8)


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 Post subject: Re: Trading Pets? Legal or not?
PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2008 1:58 am 
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Well we know it is legal now. But really, I have seen so many boards today where people are saying "Someone stole my pet! They blocked my neomails and they refuse to send me the pet I was promised!"

It is really getting out of hand.


It is a risk you have to take. Even the nicest seeming people could steal your pet.


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 Post subject: Re: Trading Pets? Legal or not?
PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2008 10:31 am 
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Didn't TNT say that was considered scamming someone and is reportable?


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 Post subject: Re: Trading Pets? Legal or not?
PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2008 12:18 pm 
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Well, between TNT saying that elaborate applications are out and trading is okay... the pound board now is overflowing with pets "up for trade" and not a single "up for adoption" ¬.¬

Mostly I don't care either way because I much prefer to create my own pets. The only thing is this pretty much ruins my already slim chances of someday adopting an unconverted pet. (that's the only reason I would ever want to adopt a pet from someone else, customization redraws ruined many of my dream pets and I'd never want to paint my own now, I'd only want to adopt an old unconverted one)

Money may or may not be able to buy you love, but it sure as heck can't buy you an unconverted Faerie Xweetok. (;


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